If you haven’t already, please read Adrienne’s post on submitting questions to the site. I applaud her for hitting every damn nail on the head, and I want to echo her bottom line: we love hearing from you; the advice columns keep this place buzzing; but please check to see if we answered your question last week. I’d also like to add that the details you can provide (practice lines, office location, level, etc.) make it easier for us to offer more precise feedback. Keep ‘em coming.
In the meantime, consider this post as Example A as to what will happen when a lazy ass individual seeks advice they can find right under their noses. With this tried to find some shred of a question to answer, but instead I found myself screaming at my monitor. If this is the product of Helicopter Parenting, we as a society are screwed. Nevertheless, we’ll get right to it:
Hey GC, how’s it going? I am writing about making a decision between EY’s FSO practice and their TAS practice. Right now there is a lot of squawk about PWC’s FSR and EY’s FSO practices. These are both very hot topics and I believe relevant to readers, as seen after the EY FSO Assurance article [this one].
First off, you’re making a decision between two different options at EY, yet refer to the “hot topic” of PwC’s FSR practice (Financial Instruments, Structured Products and Real Estate). Let’s spell out some definitions for people here who are not familiar:
1. EY FSO – Not a practice but rather a term that stands for Financial Services Office. Per their website (which I Googled like any child can do) EY’s FSO practice includes all three lines of business: assurance, tax, and advisory. It’s a go-to-market philosophy/marketing strategy/organizational hierarchy more than anything else. Go to the website to learn more, if you’re so inclined.
2. EY TAS – Transaction Advisory Services – an advisory practice by name, includes a variety of services (due diligence, restructuring, valuation, etc.). Without splitting hairs here, a TAS associate will work on FSO clients (e.g. valuing insurance claims at AIG). Said associate could also work on a transaction involving a factory in Topeka, Kansas.
3. PwC FSR – Most closely related to EY TAS as it would fall under TAS if it were at EY. But it’s not. It’s at PwC, where you don’t have an offer. Again, not relevant.
Many students have accepted or are contemplating offers from the big 4, and there are rumors circulating that FSR and FSO employees work banker hours and get paid like consultants.
You are clearly new to public accounting, Going Concern, and the world in general. Get paid like consultants? WTF does that even mean? And for the love of God, you’re not working at PwC. Stop talking about it. Note: At this point the contributor goes on with a list of questions; my feedback at the bottom.
I am having trouble making a decision between TAS and FSO. For staff one’s in NYC, total year one compensation with salary and signing bonus is between 60-70 thousand on average. Not bad, but with what kind of hours?
On the other hand, TAS year one salary is about 55k, no bonus. What type of hours can be expected? Being that all new hires in EY FSO start in BAP [link for those playing at home], a 4 year rotational program, does good old uncle Ernie just rotate their staff through busy season after busy season? How much travel can be expected in NYC, aren’t most financial clients located in the city? FSO and FSR new hires are earning on average about 10k more than their audit and TAS counterparts. If the hours are comparable to these service lines, why so much more money? If the hours are much longer in FSO, does the staff ever receive a bonus? There must be a hitch…
Readers should note: This contributor happened to email us from a company email address of a flailing/failing/going-down-in-flames investment bank and – in this writer’s opinion – should be thankful to have ANY job at ANY Big4 firm. Turns out this person has already worked at EY during a previous (and VERY recent) internship and assumedly had ample time/networks/professionals/resources/access to the Internet to answer the above asinine questions.
The hitch is that you don’t have an offer from PwC, so drop the comparison. It’s like comparing my ideal commute to work (jet pack, duh) to the one I currently have (6 train, running with delays). Comparing a PwC FSR offer to an EY TAS offer would at least be a bit more relevant.
I’m going to ignore all questions about busy season hours/travel because you should have asked them while going through the interview process. After all, that’s the point of the interview process. I’m also going to point out that your statement that, “FSO and FSR new hires are earning on average about 10k more than their audit and TAS counterparts” is wrong on many levels. First, FSO includes auditors. Second, new hires within FSO make different salaries (tax hires make XYZ, auditors makes ABC, etc.). Finally, STOP COMPARING EVERYTHING TO PwC’s FSR PRACTICE.
What you do have:
1. An offer in EY FSO: What group? I don’t have a f*cking clue, and you never told us.
2. An offer in EY TAS: Which sub-group? There are six spelled out on the company website.
So, back to one the question in your email that hasn’t been answered at GC a thousand times before:
Hey GC, how’s it going?
Overworked and underpaid. Ring a bell? Take a number.
Bottom line: read through EY’s website to understand their practice lines and acronyms, something you should have done before emailing us. Also, consider taking a job in a “safer” practice…because the last time we had record Black Friday sales was November 2008…and we all know that the house was on fire then…
True, no company is entitled to one’s labor but if EY had not been gracious enough to accept his return after departure then this would’ve been an article bashing EY from that perspective. It’s like a girlfriend leaving you for someone else, it doesn’t work out, she comes back and then is ready to leave on the first thing smoking..lol, EY should’ve denied his return the first time and made him live with his decision.
Wow… so ungrateful
More likely a her
Ey had to go through a lot of effort to rehire you, including approvals, etc. and put forth a reasonable explanation for a re-hire. Good riddence – hopefully will never take you back.
Even if true, which it probably is, that still doesn’t entitle them to this person.
Have some ethics. You don’t behave like an owner. You behave like a commodity. Accounting is a people business and yes free agent status exists but so should loyalty. Loyalty is not a bad word. They were loyal, you were not.
I think you could have handled this a bit differently Granted, your circumstances changed, but you’re looking at this rather selfishly. I used to work for EY and have since left and would have never done what you did. The reality is you’re playing the field. You have every right to do what you did. If you tell EY you’re going back, but have no intention in doing so, then don’t. Keep looking, and move on. If you think they’re a safety net to a failed decision, that’s not right. There could be other candidates who are vying for roles that you may have taken away or were being considered for. Especially in a hot market like this one. Your attitude is selfish and inconsiderate.
In 2009/2010, I had multiple interviews and was given the “There could be other candidates who are vying for roles that you may have taken away or were being considered for.” I received no offers and suffered to get my career in the door for years. Do what is best for you. Do not listen to EY because they could not give a rats ass about you. When you’re working to the point you burn out or throw up from anxiety, EY will not be there in the hospital by your bedside.
Hey free agent, I think you missing the point here. EY having agreed to take you back that shows loyalty from employer to employee and their willingness to take you back at time you yourself admitted as not knowing where to turn and how long woukd be before you have another job, many companies have policies on that and they don’t accept returning staff before 2 years have passed from resignation
If I were you I would have accepted EY over the other company knowing that you going back to an employer who cares about you and have done you a favour in your times of need.
No wonder HR were not pleased, you messed them around and played them again against other employers, it is not EY throwing a fit it you being a prima dona!
To be fair, you left for another company, got your offer rescinded and asked to come back, to which EY agreed to do (which can be a huge pain to make happen; they were already making arrangements for your replacement which requires a lot of resources) and then only a week later after they agreed to take you back and you quit again after they went through all of the effort to take you back… And you’re confused as to why they’re upset with you? Then on top of that you post this article whining about it when you were infact in the wrong in this situation. I hope future employers taking this article into consideration when hiring/not hiring you.
Did you tell EY that you were continuing to interview? I have worked at various organizations and when it comes to hiring a specific person it takes effort and approvals. The HR would have needed to get approvals to get you back. They tried be grateful.
They were disappointed and perhaps expressed it in poor words, be grateful
Honestly, if you can’t understand why EY is frustrated, it’s probably better that they let you move on.
Turn the situation around. EY interview you and express interest in having you. Someone better comes along so they tell you that they rather going with that option. That candidate drops them so they come back to you. You express interest again but a new candidate shows up who is better than you. EY again drop you in favour of the new candidate. Rinse and repeat.
With you having worked at EY in the past, I’m assuming you a professional? Act like it and treat your company how you would expect to be treated.
You left. And then got rejected. You offered to go back to EY and they graciously accepted. Be thankful that they were willing to reconsider your request. You were ungrateful by interviewing with other despite being accepted by EY. Why did you desperately wanting to go back to EY and then back stab them at the last minute? If I were your new employer, you feel entitled and would not fit in any organisation.
This person should have been upfront with HR and told them he/she would be leaving (again) upon receiving another offer. They were not…. and should have expected the type of response they received from HR. Professional conduct is a two way street.
You are still not a a whore. If you were, you would have negotiated a better rate with EY. Wondering why you didnt do that?
This is sooo unprofessional. If you dont want to go back then dont. EY is used to people leaving or changing teams all the time and people coming back. i have been with them in 3 different offices and 3 different teams and service lines so i’d know. But you have to respect this and respect you collegues, not treat them as a safety net until something “better” comes along
Totally agree, if still looking for something else go back as a contractor/ freelance but not give the people hiring you the hassle
You should be telling your selfish self this…
Remember everyone … you’re a free agent and nobody owns you or is entitled to your labor. Act like it.
Honestly, you should be telling the yourself this for being so ungrateful ….
Remember everyone … you’re a free agent and nobody owns you or is entitled to your labor. Act like it.
I am not sure if this is real or fake. But if you are really complaining about what happened to you, I guess EY is lucky not to have you as its employee. HR at EY had to work a lot on the background to be able to hire you back after you submitted your 2 week notice. Of course they would be upset to hear you changed your mind once again after you got the new offer. You should have mentioned to them that you are still interviewing with other places to keep them in the loop, or if the EY job was not for you, you should have just quit and look for other opportunities.
You’re not a person a company should hire as you’ve no integrity. Because of the likes of you, honest employees were viewed in a similar way. You’re like a monkey destroying a home
Smart posting anonymously. You sound insufferable and completely tone-deaf on the labor and understanding required to try to re-situate you. What an entitled pompous post.
Wow…surprising amount of boot lickers in the comments. Yeah it’s great that EY took this guy or gal back but do you people really think that was “loyalty” or is EY filling a seat they can bill hours from? I say good for this guy/gal for looking out for themselves and getting away from these cheaters.
You’ve no integrity and the likes of you were destroying the company culture, relationship and the core meaning of humanity. So selfish that you’ll sell your daughter for money
Get a grip. It’s a job at a shitty company that would lay you off at the drop of a dime.