Category: Big 4

If it happens at a Big 4 accounting firm, we’re talking about it here.

Comp Watch ’11: Big 4 Starting Salaries North of the Border

There’s been quite a bit of chatter out of Canada recently (Happy Thanksgiving, btw) and we now have some of the details for those receiving offers from 3 of the Big 4.

KPMG is offering $40,800 per year. They claim they will pay over time if you work over 40 hours per week.
PwC is offering $40,800 per year with a 0-15% bonus based on performance.
EY is offering $40,500 per year. No mentions of overtime.

This is for the Toronto offices and these figures are all in Canadian Dollars, which comes out to slightly below $40k USD but with the possibility of overtime, obviously the haul could be a lot more. If you’ve heard different numbers (or any Deloitte numbers at all) for these firms, get in touch or discuss below.

Fence-crossing Regulator Wants to Know How to Jump into a Big 4 Firm

Ed. note: Have a question for the career advice brain trust? Email us at advice@goingconcern.com.

I have a senior-level job with a regulator that has jurisdiction over accounting firms. (Don’t want to say much more, because it would be self-identifying.)

I think my credentials may be good enough to land a partner-level job with a Big Four to help with compliance and whatnot. I’d like to pursue this some time over the next several years.

But how should I make the approach? Should I contact the firms directly at the appropriate time? Or go through a headhunter? If a headhunter, which ones have the best contacts for senior positions?

Thanks for your help.

–Fence-crosser (sorry, I couldn’t come up with a witty name)

Fence-crosser,
Give yourself some credit – your nickname is wittier than most (and by most, I mean people usually sign their first and last names and add their Social Security number for good measure).


After a quick (and confidential) search for your background on LinkedIn, I have a much better understanding of your seniority and depth of experience in the regulatory space. Very impressive. Considering your educational background (for those of you playing at home – very strong undergrad and advanced degree programs), I have no doubt that you’ve made your mark within the inner circles of both your industry and your city (major US market).

Before we talk about how to go about pursuing opportunities within the Big 4, let’s talk about this so-called “partner-like” level where you’d like to land. Without a CPA you cannot be a partner, however principals are a non-certified equivalent and directors are nothing to slouch at, either. You’d most easily transition into either 1) a firm’s internal professional practice, helping decipher government regulation and how said firm’s practices are affected by changing laws or 2) a firm’s advisory group, aiding clients with the same issues. The upsides – both monetarily and network-wise – would be in advisory. But do not overlook being an internal expert; they are paid handsomely for their work.

When it comes to seeking out the Big 4’s interest in your particular skillset, I suggest starting with their in-house Experienced Hire recruiters. All of the firms are hot to hire people with your experience. Look into their publicly posted opportunities first; either you will find something in line with your background or at the very least find a name to contact. Check out last week’s post for links to each firm’s experienced hire pages. Your skillset would be an exceptional value added to a firm’s compliance/regulatory departments. Best of luck in transitioning.

Readers – are you familiar with this kind of transition? Have you made the move yourself? Email Caleb and he’ll connect you with Fence-crosser should you be able to help. Are you a recruiter at one of the Big 4? Do the same – contact Caleb and make this happen.

Here’s Some of the Loot Big 4 Firms Are Giving to Recruits (UPDATE) – Even More Stuff

Earlier this week, DWB put out an open call for accounting firm recruiting schwag. Pictures, comments, hell we’d even take your extras but none of you have bothered to email me to get my addy. Your lack of sharing ability will be forgiven but not forgotten, dear readers. Luckily, one recruit out of Toronto sent us a few images of the corporate treasures that Ernst & Young, KPMG, and PwC are tossing to those receiving offers. We’ve laid out the images on the following pages for your viewing pleasure and included our tipster’s thoughts on each.


Apparently this is how the E&Y stuff arrived. Someone needs to work on their bo”http://www.goingconcern.com/2011/10/heres-some-of-the-loot-big-4-firms-are-giving-to-recruits/ey-offer-1/” rel=”attachment wp-att-49718″>


EY offer package – “Cheaply made luggage tag, ball point pen, and passport wallet. A bunch of junk.”

Signing package for EY – EY branded luggage and carry on.

KPMG Offer package – “Dr.Seuss’ Oh the places you’ll go (Party Edition, nonetheless). Neoprene logo computer bag.”

Signing package for KPMG – “No one has received it yet.” UPDATE: Apparently there is no signing package from KPMG, however our tipster did say that the computer bag “was the best pre-signing gift of the three firms, so maybe that’s KPMG didn’t give out anything else.” The House of Klynveld is also throwing a second signing party for the newbies, whereas E&Y and PwC are just throwing one.


Offer package for PwC (not pictured) Now on the following pages – “PwC – PwC branded cookies, $50 prepaid AMEX credit card, hand signed PwC card.”

Signing package for PwC – “Choice between two options. (1) Backpack, binder, coffee mug. (2) Gym bag, water bottle, umbrella.”

PwC Signing

This recruit told us that he’ll be accepting with PwC but didn’t elaborate on whether he was choosing the coffee cup or the umbrella but did say that PwC is coming on pretty strong to those receiving offers:

Another student who has offers from both EY and PwC received a call from the CEO of PwC to ask her to join PwC. Now I wish I hadn’t signed yet, so I could have talked to him.

Choose wisely, grasshoppers.

That cookies looks repulsive but our tipster says that “It’s soft and looks amazing.” Right.

Where Is Ernst & Young Finding All This Musical Talent?

Look, I understand that these firms want well-rounded individuals but when more and more people start showing talents that outshine their professional services skills, it makes you wonder if the recruiting folks need a talking to. I bring this up because, unbeknownst to us, FORTUNE puts together a Battle of the Corporate Bands every year and this year’s winner is American PI, a 12-member band, 11 of which are E&Y employees. Granted, they won’t be winning Record of the Year any time soon since they’re simply covering I Heard It Through the Grapevine, Southbound, People Get Ready, and Superstition but they did have three members win “best of” awards.

And with this triumph by American PI, E&Y now has rock, show tunes, and hip-hop covered. It’s probably only a matter of time until they manage to poach the PwC pianist.

[via AT]

Ernst & Young Just Gave the New York Attorney General 22.9 Billion Reasons to Feel a Little More Motivated Today

Because business is good at E&Y. Not PwC good or Deloitte good but good enough.

Ernst & Young today announced combined global revenues of US$22.9 billion for the financial year ended 30 June 2011, compared with US$21.3 billion in 2010, a 7.6% increase. In local currency, revenues grew 5.3%. “We have had a very strong year in each of our four geographic areas. We continue to see very positive reactions to the way we have globalized our organization over the last few years, our investments in emerging markets and the great dedication and commitment of our people,” said Jim Turley, Global Chairman and CEO of Ernst & Young.

Also, Jimbo says that E&Y is “focused on building lifelong relationships with our people. This ensures we have outstanding talent to provide our clients the best service wherever they do business.” So if your heart belongs to show business, fine. But your ass belongs to Ernst & Young.

[via E&Y]

Is This Ernst & Young Auditor the Next Character on Glee?

I don’t watch Glee. Hell, I don’t even have TV. I did flip through the GQ spread with Lea Michelle and Dianna Agron but otherwise, I’m completely unfamiliar with any of the characters on the show. ANYWAY, I hear it’s popular. It’s so popular that regular people want to be characters on the show as overblown versions of themselves and are submitting auditions for a chance to do so. One of these regular people is Nick DeSanto, an auditor at Ernst & Young.

We can’t embed Nick’s audition video from the Glee Project web page but we did find his YouTube channel so we can give you idea of his talent:


More about Nick – he worked for a couple of years at McGladrey before joining E&Y’s FSO Media & Entertainment group, where he’s been for about a year. We spoke to him over email and by phone (he “visit[s] GC almost every day”) and that this audition is his first stab at breaking into showbiz. Can you imagine if he had been involved with the In a JIT project? His singing career would already be on the fast track, winning Tonys and such.

So go over and support him at his Glee Audition page by liking his page if you feel so inclined. And even if you don’t feel the urge, go and like/vote for him anyway. Just because your dreams won’t come true, doesn’t mean you can’t support someone who’s trying to do something to achieve theirs.

Are You a Loser If You Don’t Make Partner at a Big 4 Firm?

Good morning capital market servants. Presumably, none of you were on the Brooklyn Bridge yesterday which also probably means you’ve still got a job, a career to think about, etc. etc.

How’s that going by the way? Are you on the partner track or do you have partner tracks on your back? Haven’t given it much thought lately but hey, this is what you’re doing and sure, making partner seems like a sweet gig, amiright?

Well an interesting statement from the Grumpy Old Accountants today got me to thinking about all of you hoping for a seat at the big table:

In fact, in the Big Four accounting firms today, if you don’t make partner, you often are considered a loser.


Now this little snippet comes out of a much larger discussion about why some many accountants are cheaters (it’s because everyone wants to be perceived as a “winner”). That’s a fine discussion as well, and the GOA post is worth a read, but we’ll focus on the notion that “no parter = loser.”

I certainly had my own partner aspirations for a brief point in time and many of you out there in Big 4 land have them right now. For me, my attitude changed when I observed a few partners, saw what their workload and lives were like and thought, “JESUS H. CHRIST, BEING A PARTNER SUCKS.”

The problem is, if you’re appear to be making a career for yourself at a Big 4 firm (I was quite the nomad which doesn’t really work), what is the ultimate goal? No one says to themselves, “I’d be fine with making Senior Manager in 8-10 years and then spending THE NEXT 30 in that same position.” As such, partner is a goal for many of you. However, we all know that Senior Manager is a parking lot in most service lines, so it may not be 30 years at SM but it’ll sure seem like 30. Having said that, if you like your firm, are reasonably good to FUCKING AWESOME at your job, then why wouldn’t you want to make partner? Not all Big 4 partners are created equal but if you’re on the fast track at PwC, would doing anything less than being admitted to the partnership satisfy your professional ambitions? And if you give up on career goals because…well, just because…does that not make you a L-O-S-E-R?

The answer is no. Personally, I’ve seen plenty of people with partner-level talent, hot on the partner track give it up because 1) something better comes along; 2) They want their life back; 3) SOMETHING BETTER COMES ALONG. In fact, many new partners are working harder than ever (i.e. “like a 2nd Year Senior Associate” has been overheard). Does that sound like a “winner” to you? GOA might have it exactly bassackwards. The last thing most Big 4 alums will tell you is that they feel like losers because they didn’t make partner. Quite the opposite in fact. It’s probably more accurate to say you’re a loser if you think you’ve got a shot at making partner at a Big 4 firm.

UDPATE:
Professor Ketz clarifies below (seen via Twitter) that they the GOAs were talking about the culture within the Big 4 firms rather than you individual losers:

As we said, “… IN THE BIG FOUR ACCOUNTING FIRMS TODAY, if you don’t make partner, you often are considered a loser” (emphasis added). We were discussing the culture of the large accounting firms–we were not discussing our evaluations of those who are not partners. After all, we aren’t partners and we hope we aren’t losers!!

I’ll continue my contrary narrative here and argue that this not the case either. As we know, Big 4 firms sell themselves as great places to start careers but they don’t regularly make the case that this is where you want to spend 15-20 years of your professional life. The culture inside has evolved to accept attrition as part of the formula and that younger professionals are anxious when it comes to getting ahead. In fact, things have changed so much that convincing the talented professionals to stay is part of the culture. Hearing “You’ve got a bright future here,” from a pair of partners over lunch is standard these days because they know the “winners” will leave and the “losers” don’t know when to get out.

Will Years Out of the Game Negate the Big 4 Boomerang Effect?

Ed. note: Have a question for the career advice brain trust? Email us at advice@goingconcern.com.

Here’s an issue I rarely see. I joined PwC management consulting right out of my Ivy League school, and have my undergrad degree in Economics. I loved it, worked hard, made manager in five years and worked for some huge clients. I did all of the extras, methodology writing, promotion committees, coaching, proposals, etc. Managed some huge high profile projects too. Was offered a slot at PwC’s new executive MBA program, and was in the alpha class, graduating with a concentration in Marketing (picked by the firm). But then we had huge post 9/11 layoffs, were spun off and bought by IBM. I left soon after to start a family. I was there nearly ten years.

I went back to school and got my MSAT, and now am halfway through my CPA exam, acing it thanks to my teaching and experience. I’ve been teaching accounting and tax at a major university for the past four years as an adjunct, and doing a little private consulting.

Can I get back in to Big 4? Do I do it as an experienced hire? I know I’ve never been a practicing auditor but I know the methodology and how to manage large engagements. What’s the best way for me to work my way back in? My former colleagues are all at IBM or have left. I am not eligible for on campus since I graduated with my latest masters in 2009.
Thanks!

DISCLAIMER: not every circumstance in the history of circumstances has been taken into consideration when making this statement:

Public accounting – you can always come back.

The flow of people out of public accounting is much more intense and consistent than the experienced hire onboards, but that’s not to say it’s impossible. I did a little searching on LinkedIn and realized that you live in the greater New York City area, which is to your advantage. Many of the Big 4’s support staffs are located in NYC, so there might be options in those areas of the firms if a return to client servicing is not possible. so your odds of finding an opportunity and a new home with one of the Big4 improve slightly. Start with searching their Experienced Hire websites for open opportunities. Links are below:

Deloitte

E&Y

KPMG

PwC

Scour LinkedIn for experienced hire recruiters within each firm and reach out to them directly; have them hear your story. Most importantly, be persistent. The experienced hiring model within the Big 4 is can be touch and go, especially considering the recent uncertainty in the economy.

Deloitte Auditor, Contemplating a Busy Season Walkout, Concerned That Fellow Employees Aren’t as Enthused as He Is

You may have heard a few stories about a little campout going on down on Wall Street the last week or so. It’s been quite a ruckus and now Hizzoner is even getting a little tired of it. Despite the good, the bad and the hippies, all this standing up and shouting and whatnot seems to have inspired one “disenchanted” Deloitte auditor who sent u

I know that I work for my firm in an at will contract, I can quit at anytime and get another job. But I’ve been feeling so slighted for the last several months by leadership’s complete lack of concern for the well being of their workforce that I want to do something more significant. If I quit, some managers will be temporarily upset because my hours will need to be replaced, and they will find someone who doesn’t have the same experience with the client etc. They will get over it in a day, and the giant audit machine will keep turning the same as always, and employees will continue to get the worst of it.

But this is America, we are champions of workers’ rights. Can’t we do a little better than this for ourselves? I understand that with unemployment currently so high this isn’t really a time when workers’ rights are a high priority, but we still deserve better treatment. With Deloitte still swelling based on last weeks’ figures, and loving the attention in the media for being a model of a growing global enterprise their vulnerability becomes clear. They would hate bad press or anything that would stunt growth.

This is why I think an organized but non-unionized strike/walkout, perhaps around, I dunno, the upcoming busy season, would be very effective at getting leadership’s attention. I know I’m no Cesar Chavez, and a white collar walkout it rare thing, as white collar unions are uncommon, and that this is something that would be difficult for generally conservative accounts who are typically anti-union to get done. But I figure, if there is any forum where this sort of movement would/could begin it would be on Going Concern where people are more openly cynical and feel just as disappointed with Deloitte’s version of an audit practice as I do. Not sure who would actually put their careers on the line because I doubt most really believe in the cause, but I think they feel the same sentiment. It would be interesting to hear the true anonymous thoughts of others on this idea, and if there are any brighter ideas on reminding firm leadership whose backs they are standing on to potentially improve the livelihood of those backs. What do you recommend?

Well, Cesar, I do have a few recommendations for your planned walkout. First – take pictures. Lots of them. And then send them to us. Secondly, get a noisy instrument. Preferably a drum or vuvuzela. If you have to do this mission solo like you think you will, you’ll need some help in the noise department. Third – a costume of some sort – I’m thinking Benji Bankes – would advisable and then be sure to incorporate suggestion number one. Fourth – read Adrienne’s post from this summer on why this is an awful idea. The whole thing is worth a read but here’s a taste:

I think part of the reason why anyone you suggest this to might think you’re one tax season away from the funny farm is that CPAs already have a large, powerful trade association which allegedly exists to serve its interests. Granted, the AICPA does more lobbying in Washington than it does to accounting firm partners about easing up on you poor shlubs who have to do all the work, but it’s still a trade association.[…] [T]hough it may not feel like it, most of you are paid pretty fairly compared to, say, McDonald’s cashiers, Starbucks baristas and Walmart greeters. It may not feel fair based on the service you provide (understandably) but in the big picture, making $50,000 a year fresh out of school in middle America ain’t too bad of a gig. You get vacations, safe work conditions, bonuses, insurance and even free CPA review materials if you’re lucky. I bet OSHA has never seen the inside of a Big 4 office to investigate a fatal Excel accident or random intern decapitation at the coffee machine.

Maybe I’m wrong but the leaders of these firms would love – LOVE! – if you wrote them an email about your concerns. If the response you get sounds canned, then there’s nothing wrong with saying so. Your partner may catch some heat (that will eventually blow back on you) but Dr. Phil and JoeE aren’t really doing their jobs if they simply dismiss the widely held concerns of the Green Dot community. If you’re feeling inspired enough to rally some fellow opiners, make some signs and sit on the sidewalk shouting, then by all means do so but do keep in mind that you will end up in these pages, may be permanently confined to a JIT or straight up lose your job. Just some things to mull over.

PwC Won’t Allow an Upset in Vault’s Prestige Rankings

Earlier this week, we learned that Grant Thornton was the new numero uno on Vault’s Accounting 50. The VA50 is determined by a number metrics that are weighted to come up with an overall score as to which firm is the best of the best. According to Vault, Grant Thornton was able to leverage their better work-life balance for employees to overcome their lack of prestige to pull this off.

For many people in the accounting world, however, this is meaningless. Reputation is everything and if you’re not working for one of the firms that are of highest regard, you’re simply a chump. Accordingly, Vault still presents a prestige ranking and while there aren’t many surprises, for many, this is the list. And the top firm on the list? P. Dubs.

1 (1) PwC
2 (3) Deloitte
3 (2) Ernst & Young
4 (4) KPMG
5 (5) Grant Thornton


6 (7) McGladrey
7 (6) BDO
8 (8) Moss Adams
9 (10) J.H. Cohn
10 (9) Plante & Moran
11 (13) Crowe Horwath
12 (12) Clifton Gunderson
13 (11) EisnerAmper
14 (22) LarsonAllen
15 (14) Rothstein Kass
16 (15) BKD
17 (18) Baker Tilly Virchow Krause
18 (16) Reznick Group
19 (21) Dixon Hughes Goodman
20 (19) Cherry Bekaert & Holland
21 (24) Anchin, Block & Anchin
22 (17) WeiserMazars
23 (23) CBIZ/Mayer Hoffman McCann
24 (29) ParenteBeard
25 (28) Wipfli
26 (31) Friedman
27 (27) Marcum
28 (34) Berdon
29 (35) Citrin Cooperman & Co.
30 (36) Eide Bailly
31 (26) UHY Advisors
32 (37) WithumSmith + Brown
33 (32) Elliot Davis
34 (38) Margolin, Winer & Evens
35 (33) Marks Paneth & Shron
36 (40) Blackman Kallick
37 (25) Novogradac & Company
38 (49) RubinBrown
39 (NR) Schonbraun McCann Group
40 (50) Kaufman, Rossin & Co.
41 (NR) Lattimore Black Morgan & Cain
42 (45) Frank Rimerman & Co.
42 (48) Habif, Arogeti & Wynne
43 (NR) Buff Pilger Mayer, Inc.
44 (NR) Horne
45 (NR) Rehmann
46 (NR) Schenck SC
46 (NR) Suby, Von Haden & Associates
46 (NR) Ehrhardt Keefe Steiner & Hottman
47 (41) Aronson & Company
48 (NR) SingerLewak
49 (47) SS&G Financial Services
50 (NR) Katz, Sapper & Miller

Oh! and probably most importantly, the prestige ranking is what we use to seed the brackets for the Coolest Accounting Firm in the spring, so it’s doubly important. Commence bickering.

Deloitte Resents the Notion That They Should Have Known That Taylor, Bean & Whitaker Was a Massive Fraud

As we mentioned briefly, Deloitte has been sued for $7.6 billion by the bankruptcy trustee of Taylor, Bean & Whitaker and Ocala Funding, LLC. If you’ve never heard of Taylor, Bean & Whitaker then check out Jr. Deputy Accountant who’s been all over it since the Feds starting kicking down the doors. Long story short – TBW was a giant fraud perpetrated by its management, Colonial Bank owned a lot of TBW’s mortgages, Colonial failed, Bank of America bought up a bunch of the mortgages, Fannie Mae says they’re owed money, CHRIST, it’s a mess.

Anyhoo, Steven Thomas, who is known for suing the pants of Big 4 firms (and BDO!), is the lead attorney for the plaintiffs and it sounds like the age-old story of auditors BEING COMPLETE IDIOTS:

“Deloitte missed this fraud because it simply accepted management’s conflicting, incomplete and often last-minute explanations of highly-questionable transactions, even though those explanations made no sense and were flatly contradicted by documents in Deloitte’s possession,” one of the lawsuits says.

Of course Deloitte isn’t amused by this, as Deloitte spokesman Jonathan Gandal’s statement attests:

Gandal said the blame for the fraud and losses should rest squarely on Taylor Bean, Ocala Funding and Farkas. “The bizarre notion that his engines of theft are entitled to complain of injury from their own crimes and to sue the outside auditors they lied to defies common sense, not to mention the law,” Gandal said on behalf of Deloitte.

If this statement strikes you as a little confusing, then you’re not alone. First off, when Mr. Gandal is referring to the “the law” he’s probably referring to this. In less legalese, basically what Deloitte is saying is that Lee Farkas and his merry band of crooks are the ones responsible for this shitshow not the Green Dot and therefore, this whole thing is ludicrous. I mean, come on guys, what could a firm that just reported nearly $29 billion in revenue could possibly have done differently? Crooks are just far too smart far auditors. Just ask one.