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Tag: Exodus

Layoff and Exodus Watch ’10: Grant Thornton Chicago and New York Seeing Movement

Two weeks ago, we heard that Grant Thornton’s Cleveland office started their layoffs a little earlier than what on might expect that was followed by an emergency meeting that the content of which is still a mystery.

Now we’ve received word on Chicago and New York who are rumored to be having layoffs and some quitters respectively.


From a Chipman Blog Reader:

I work in audit at Grant Thornton and have heard through the grapevine that offices are trying to keep staff. With the job market improving, it seems like other offices are looking to see if staff/seniors voluntary leave before making any final decisions pre-promotion day. Chicago has let go a partner and 2 senior managers in the audit practice and rumors are swirling of a few staff reductions, which seems crazy given that the current A1 class and the incoming class are so small. For other offices, national is working to roll out a benefit plan practice similar to what Chicago has to help keep staff busy during the summer months but it looks like this is not moving quickly enough….[T]he GT wire is that NY saw 10+ individuals put in their notice recently.

We left messages with both the Chicago and New York offices, neither of which have been returned.

An accountant close to the situation indicated that the partner and senior manager layoffs are part of those mentioned by Stephen Chipman back in January.

At that time, SC said that many of those partners and senior managers were already being notified, so since these most recent cuts knew that this day was coming, it was awfully generous of them to stay on for this busy season (we’re guessing there was money involved).

As far as the the staff situation in Chicago is concerned, cuts at the staff level do seem crazy if the classes are small. Meanwhile, although some attrition in New York was probably expected, at this point, it’s not clear whether 10+ leaving in mid-April is a lot or a little. Keep us updated.

Promotion Watch ’10: Deloitte Slowly Lengthens the Corporate Ladder

Yesterday we told you about the unofficial “our bad” from Deloitte on the layoffs that happened last spring. While that doesn’t necessarily address any of the subsequent layoffs, it’s a start.

And we have a little update from our previous query about Deloitte compensation increases as well as some promotion time-frame news:


A Green Dot familiar with the situation told us the following:

– There will be raises this year
– People shouldn’t expect raises like the ones back in the SOX days
– As always, there will be an effort to reward strong performers

At the same time, promotions may be a different story, at least for the R-space, where they want to move away from the “3 years to senior” mentality, towards a “ready to be a senior” mentality. Promotion time-frames are expected to be lengthened, although comp will remain competitive.

We should note that the raises in this case refer to the NE AERS, so if you’re hearing different in your region, let us know. The “won’t be like the SOx years” message also reiterates what DWB said on Tuesday about curbing your enthusiasm, so at least try to be realistic.

Regarding the promotion news, the effect on “R-space” which for you non-Deloittes means the “Advisory Practice,” our source indicated that this has been in the works for some time but has been poorly enforced in the past, with most eligible promotees getting the bump after three years in the trenches.

Further, it sounds as though the extended promotion time-frame (i.e. replacing “ready” with a given number of years) will occur at all levels, especially from senior manager to partner. Our source then mused, “Since Partners own their [senior managers]… it’ll be interesting to see how turn-over ends up.” That will certainly resonate with those that already consider senior manager to be a parking lot on the road to partner.

Deloitte isn’t the only firm that has given serious consideration to the lengthening of the corporate ladder. Last December we discussed KPMG’s always-being-discussed plans to move away from the six-year manager track in their audit practice. Back then we said:

The rumor that the KPMG bigwigs have been considering a six year timeline to make manager in the audit practice has been kicked around for at least a couple years. Naturally, there were two schools of thought:

• Managers thought it was good idea

• SAs thought it was a terrible idea

Deloitte insisting that salaries will remain competitive should quell some concerns although there are some out there that do get hung up on titles. So while it seems that Deloitte will be getting back to merit increases for FY ’10, they’re being much quieter about it and may be getting serious about adding some rungs to the ladder. Climb with patience.

Big 4 Firms Are Planning for Your Exodus

For some time now, Caleb has been touching on the upcoming/ongoing/always-occurring exodus from Big 4 into the private sector. The obvious reasons for the change from public to private are obvious, but here’s a few for kicks:

• Bigger pay day (and potential growth)

• CPA requirements completed

• Actual work/life balance

&ill set transition to a new career

There are other reasons of course, but it is the ferocious combination of these that leads to the breaking point – low morale.


Going Concern received an email from a distraught and burnt out Big 4 auditor from the Southeast region:

The level of morale in the [XYZ] office is at an all time low. Discussion with low level staff, through managers, have yielded the same opinion of overwhelming expectations without the needed support from the firm. They want us to draw blood from a turnip, and they want it done better, faster, and with less resources than last year. This has caused everyone to start exploring options in the market. A vast majority have started fielding resumes and contacting recruiting firms. The select few who have made it past that hurdle are interviewing with no looking back.

Not to downplay what this auditor is saying (and I’m not), but this sounds like the unfortunate reality of many auditors working on smaller, non-public clients. You know, the not-as-sexy-as-ABC Bank but just as important to the firm’s bottom line. You won’t get tickets to the pro sport’s game, but thankyouverymuch for your efforts.

The reader goes on:

Primarily, people have expressed their interest in holding out any real intentions of leaving until promotions roll around in the later part of the summer. They’re hoping that maybe there will be some juicy 20% raise waiting for them, but the stark reality of a measly 5% raise is what they know is coming. Any fifth year Seniors who are waiting for the promotion to manager are just using it for resume purposes.

Our offices are already using under qualified second year staff at the Senior level, as well as retaining new managers in the Senior position because they are extremely understaffed at that level. This, in turn, is causing all of those people to take measures to leave perhaps after busy season and certainly after the insulting promotions come through in August.

It’s a matter of time before this individual (and half of their respective office) becomes another statistic that the Big 4 HR guru’s term “natural attrition.” From an HR perspective, here’s a loose idea of the attrition formula:

Fall 2010: 100 new hires

Fall ’11: 95 new hires become “2nd years”

Summer/Fall ’12: 88 2nd years promoted to senior staff, 70 seniors remain

Summer/Fall ’12: 2 years of public experience reached, 55 seniors remain

Summer/Fall ’13: 45 seniors remain

Summer/Fall ’14: 35 seniors remain

Summer/Fall ’15: 25 seniors remain; 15 promoted to manager, 10 remain on as seniors

Summer/Fall ‘XX: 10 senior managers are eligible for partner

The recession stunted this formula for every firm, as they were forced to make cuts, not only for cost cutting purposes, but also to keep their staffing formulas close to being in-check. But think about it – your firm expects this kind of turnover. They know it’s a matter of time before their hiring class is whittled down to 10% of its original size.

And in the case of the reader, their firm dropped the analytic ball 3-5 years ago. Had they better estimated the percentage of projected losses, there would be more seniors to handle the work.

Remember that time you felt bad about leaving? They’re waiting for you to do so.

Are We Experiencing a Big 4 Exodus?

Thumbnail image for Moving on.jpgMaybe! Nevermind people leaving involuntarily for a second.
We’re hearing from many that people are heading for the exits en masse and it’s getting the bigwigs’ attention. According to one reader:
“[A]pparently its got higher ups here a bit worried. It was an agenda [point] for a [recent manager] meeting. Just wondering how it was elsewhere. “
Of course, this leads to many, many, many teams finding themselves short-staffed. We just heard that the New York office of one Big 4 firm has been contacting other offices aggressively recruiting audit personnel for huge advisory engagements. This has been received with a resounding “GET BENT” since those offices desperately need the people for their local audit engagements.
It can be easily argued that the reason people are bolting is because of the pay freeze trend or since no one’s job seems to be safe, people are simply taking matters into their own hands.
So discuss in the comments what you’re seeing, hearing, and speculating about regarding people leaving your firm. This may be an office by office phenomenon so we’ll put out to you to give us the details for your office, your team, your firm in general.